The Harlow and Joe trial(s) are scheduled for September 2, 2008. Which means we have exactly three long, hot summer months of blogging ahead of us. Provided plea deals for both do not come up, of course...bringing our Kocisphere to a merciful and early end.
Expectations of such deals, while they flicker up from time to time, appear to be dimming. In no way due to recalcitrance on the part of Joe or Harlow, mind you. For example, Joe's stated intention to prison informants that he wants to turn Harlow in, and cut a deal...plus motions by Harlow's attorney's to supress statements made to police following his arrest. It is clear that both Harlow and Joe DESPERATELY want any deal they can get at this point, and would grasp at any crumb the DA would throw them right now.
Problem is, the prosecution seems unwilling to throw such a crumb. Apparantly, they have such an airtight case they don't see any advantage in such an offer. A death penalty conviction would be nice resume addition for the DA's working on this case, and this seems to be what they are gunning for. And who can blame them?
So, looks to me like we got ourselves a trial.
That being the case, I'm am going to pace myself a bit here on this blog. Up until now, I have had a lot to say (as is my nature, as I am sure all of you know, LOL!) and I have been churning out posts here at a rate of 2-3 a week. Well, I'm going to slow that down a bit, to about a post a week. I actually am worried about running out of things to say here, during what may well be a somewhat uneventful 3-month wait until trial.
See also The Sword's recent needling on this subject ("...However, a whole cottage industry of blogs has sprouted in the wake of the murders, each more eager than the next to discuss the non-news of the day..."). They have a point, I suppose.
A post a week for three months should be enough time I think to complete my Musings, attend to a couple other important matters (ie, my thoughts on the Sons of Sam blog, recently exposed as a pro-Harlow "black-ops blog," masquerading as an absurd and bloodthirsty anti-Harlow blog), and opine when something relatively eventful does actually occur during this period (such as the bombshell "whos who" of Harlow-connected personalities PC has been publishing as of late).Look for my next post next Monday or so. And on or about Mondays following that. Comments will still be checked and approved at the usual speedy rate here, however, so please feel free to contribute and discuss as before. Thanks!
Update: Um...where to begin....
Oh hell, just read PC's latest post, and the comments there and here. I'm off to bed!
Update 2: New Times Leader story on the Renee witness situation.
Update 3: Occuring LIVE! Right now in the comments...the exclusive Chinchilla interview with Renee Martin! :-) Which feels a bit odd, as I've never done a worldwide exclusive interview before...in fact I've never wanted to do one, either...oh well lets wing it here...
Update 4: "Renee said...Jim, Hey i hear kent is wanting an exclusive interview would you please convey to him to piss off." Duly conveyed, with pleasure!!!!!
Update 5: OK gang, I have to get back to the real world now for a spell (not to mention dropping off my soiled jammies at the dry cleaners)...and since I'm approaching 200 comments anyways, I'll shut this thread down.
I'll be back with a new topic to post under for us all (Will The Last H&J Supporter Please Turn Out The Lights...). In the meantime, the party moves to PC and BB's and SoS and anywhere else it might end up at. Ta for now! :-)
175 comments:
jim,
You are funny!
You will always have things to say!! and people listening! :)
Now -what is this about "sons of sams blog"???????
It's a fake.
More on that later...
By all means, do enlighten us regarding the Sons of Sam blog. Who is behind it--names and why? and what do they hope to gain?
Whatever you have planned sounds fascinating.
"Who is behind it--names and why? and what do they hope to gain?"
I can't name the name. To do so would violate my "no-identity speculation" policy.
As far as why, I've briefly listed a couple of the main reasons parathentically on my Blogroll entry for SOS, to the right.
I'll have more to say later.
..if you are trying to build suspense jim -
it is working!!!
:))~
Well, I'm not really trying to build suspense...just slowing down the pace of blogging here a bit.
And honestly, does this come as a great shock to anyone? Just by looking at the site, with it's pornographic imagery of capitol punishment, you can tell it's only purpose is to disgust people. It is a characture of what the few remaining Harlow supporters out there (mostly family members) think of us truthful Kocis bloggers...bloodthursty villains out to butcher their precious Harlow.
By being what it is, and proclaiming itself to be "anti-Harlow," it is attempting to tarnish bloggers like PC, DeW, bb and me by association.
Like I said, I'll post more comprehensive thoughts on this later.
And one more very general comment: When I say "Harlow" in the comment above, I do actually mean "Harlow and Joe."
A lot of times I'll just say "Harlow" as shorthand for both; saying "Harlow and Joe-ites" or "Harlow and Joe family members" or "anti-Harlow-and-Joe-ites" would probably be more accurate.
But less stylistic. Plus, I'm lazy. :-)
So, if you see just "Harlow" in comments like that above where the context indicates I could be referring to both...I usually am.
You are exactly right jim and I too was thinking that,
we are not people who are "out to execute, or out for blood"
We ARE truthful and have been searching for the truth.
With regards to "son of sam" -
nobody ever went there-
that must have been the reason why-
it was scary IMO-
it is not what people who were legitimately blogging on this case were interested in or looking for.
You said all of this, I know, but I too was thinking the exact same thing.
So, no it is not a surprise.
"You said all of this, I know, but I too was thinking the exact same thing."
Yeah I think we all were.
Anyways, now that the word is out, the site (and the blogger behind it) are both now effectively neutralized.
Well,
This makes pefect sense to me-
The Reverand - or Pastor George and Kent Barclay are becoming close in unity with Harlow Raymond Cuadra.
The Rev - I mean Pastor thinks that people here have made fun of "His God"
No Pastor, I believe it was you who were being made fun of.
You should be clear on that!
You will go far with support from the likes of Mr Barclay, it will be good for the both of you, especially now that "we will be seeing Kent Barclay stepping up his support of Harlow"
So Pastor, it will be strictly religion now?, no snide comments [oh, maybe a few huh?] but never anything solid about support for Harlow- nothing more than "Harlow and I enjoyed a good laugh thinking about the bloggers in their soiled pajamas with nothing better to do than blog about this case"
Shallow stuff coming from a man of your stature, college educated and a parent to boot- imagine that?!
Will you [and the legion of other supporters] be sticking around Reverand, oh- Pastor after the verdict when your young friend will be sentenced to spend the better portion of the remainder of his life behind bars?, or worse.
No, that brings no joy, but it is a fact, and where does that leave you Pastor George?. Besides picking up another job, Harlow and/or canteen forever ain't cheap!
Harlow getting alot of laughs these days Pastor?
In reality, I am sure it has been awhile since Harlow enjoyed a good laugh- watch the fibs Pastor, you will have to repent!
You bringin' him great joy though??
You have gone in at least 3 different directions with your support for Harlow but only have been successful in making an ass out of yourself.
Keep up that awesome support.
"watch the fibs Pastor, you will have to repent!"
VJ you are referring to my faith tradition and its sacrament of Reconciliation(Confession). The Rev is born again.
Jim - Thanks for sending me to that hilarious Sword entry, and congrats on the mention, though I temper that because YOU KNOW WHO was there too! How does a thing like that happen? Oh well, I left a comment, as is my wont. My criticism of the blogosphere most definitely does not include you!
Chinchilla Jim's inspiring Chinchilla portrait motto: "Welcome to Mt. Shitmore bitches," as exclaimed by Elm in envy and sheer awe.
Son of Sam blog--the Harlowites and Joettes are really something else. Those Son of Sam serial murders were not funny to the victims, the victims' families, the NYPD detective task force or the 3 borrough District Attorneys involved. The Younkers, NY police and the Younkers District Attorney did not find them humorous either; they reopened the investigation.
Some of the detectives on the Son of Sam task force were not satisfied that David Berkowitz was solely responsible for a host of reasons. Jimmy Breslin, the reporter sat on a key piece of evidence left at a crime scene. He and his newspaper got into heaps of trouble on that. Upshot: Breslin started alluding to the murderer as a nutcase, a position he has never abandoned, even in the face of contrary evidence.
The Bronx DA did not go along willingly with his two brethern, meaning that cooler heads believed the evidence pointed to multiple killers. Hence, no full justice.
In so far as the current case is concerned on the matter of Harlow and Joe, there is no exclupatory evidence. However, it is clear that Harlow and Joe arrived at Kocis' house with a systematic looting plan which changed on Harlow's executive action. The pilfering and looting that did take place was not helter skelter.
Now, least a particular party, gets the idea that Sean passed along that kind of info to the grifting murderers, that strand of logic goes down fast, because it was never discussed.
On another blog, Elm is trying to rewrite history as is another blogging persona. The date of contact keeps changing even at this late date. What is on the record, found by Jim, is 20 March 2007 in which a defendant is attempting contact with Elm by name. Which leads to a related conundrum: the claim for filming in Hawaii as opposed to the refuge actually taken, Florida. Deflection of course.
For that individual who has issues with the Luzerne County courts, your claims of calamity aside, the defendants are being tried in Luzerne County. A change of venue is not even on the agenda. Voire dire will be taking place and from the voting rolls of Luzerne County, PA, the location of the murder.
I intuit that Rev. George may be yet a fourth set of ten fingers on the same keyboard. I go into these gnostic trances and receive Words of Knowledge.
"Apparantly, they have such an airtight case they don't see any advantage in such an offer. A death penalty conviction would be nice resume addition for the DA's working on this case, and this seems to be what they are gunning for."
I think your right. I hope your right.
Rob said...
Now, least a particular party, gets the idea that Sean passed along that kind of info to the grifting murderers, that strand of logic goes down fast, because it was never discussed.
Are you referring to the beach tapes? If so (and I DO NOT believe BC had anything to do with the murder), he wouldn't implicate himself on tape. Or am I completely misinterpreting your statement?
Hi rob,
I hope you don't think that I was poking fun at religion.
I am poking fun at Monsignor George.
He is a joke!
The fact that he is using religion and acting as if he can withstand the suffering that he is under - for the good of the cause-
is too much-
It is bizarre that he would think anyone does not see straight through him.
Jim - Can't you ramp up another scandal like Ethangate or something in the interim?
Will,
LOL!
I'll see what I can do...
"Are you referring to the beach tapes? If so (and I DO NOT believe BC had anything to do with the murder), he wouldn't implicate himself on tape. Or am I completely misinterpreting your statement?"
Will G--No, Sean is not involved, excepting as the witness for the prosecution that he is. I was talking pre-murder. You see BB likes to suggest that Sean and Grant egged Harlow and Joe on to murder Kocis. No merit to that claim. You must understand that BB likes to feign neutrality to the host here. He's not neutral.
Go to Elm's latest blog. The pair are trying to rewrite history. If you go to Jason Curious' blog 3 to 4 days after 24 Jan. 2007, you will find a "Brett" post. Brett is discussing the backdoor deal, the details of which were not on any blog, and only overheard by suspect Harlow Cuadra. Cuadra never blogged as Brett. The Brett persona was used by Robert Wagner, not a 3rd party. There were also posts in the same place at the same time by "Anonymous," a persona used by Cad who was one of the last people to speak with Kocis telephonically on the night of his death. Cad contacted Jason to take down those Anonymous posts. Jason, to his credit, refused. Not speculation, fact. Hence, BB's contempt.
Go to BB's blog and then the link to the video clip. It is of Sean and the clip is an outtake from "Take It Like a Bad Boy." It is from an angle never used in the commercial release, even as bonus material. Robert Wagner would function as Kocis' assistant cameraman and also a film editor. He had access and would keep backups. Do the math.
Incidentally, watch Renee developments. They have a bearing on someone else who like 3-way phone discussions.
VJ--
No offense whatsoever. I was stating that Rev. George does not subscribe to confession because he is a born again believer type.
"Go to BB's blog and then the link to the video clip. It is of Sean and the clip is an outtake from "Take It Like a Bad Boy." It is from an angle never used in the commercial release, even as bonus material."
The clip is from "Take It Like A BITCH Boy". As usual your ramblings are lies.
Again, your credibility is and always will be huge problem for you.
Rob said, "For that individual who has issues with the Luzerne County courts, your claims of calamity aside, the defendants are being tried in Luzerne County. A change of venue is not even on the agenda. Voire dire will be taking place and from the voting rolls of Luzerne County, PA, the location of the murder."
Rob, I know you weren't talking to me but you know I have concerns about the location of this trial. I also look at this case from the back end. The trial will end, then the appeals start. Those are my concern. That is where this case will be lost if it is to be lost.
The clip is from "Take It Like A BITCH Boy". As usual your ramblings are lies.
Sorry Wagner this film was retitled per the settlement agreement and that is the way it sell now at retail.
A problem with your credibility. You left out information at PC's regarding the email sent by Robert Wagner on Kocis behalf regarding Danny Moilin/Cuadra. If you quote Wagner, do be thorough. You got nailed for that after the state police traced the IP back to Wagner.
Albert, I appreciate your concern about appeals. Without a lynch mob mentality or clear evidence of substantial bias in Luzerne Cty media, voir dire will take place in Luzerne County.
Rob - Thanks for all of that info. It's going to take me a while to sift through it.
In the meantime, though, I'm still not sure I understand what you meant by "it was never discussed." By whom? If you meant by Sean, Harlow, and Joe, I'm afraid that's kind of a circular argument, isn't it? Like saying it couldn't have happened because it didn't happen?
I'm really sorry if I'm being hopelessly dense about this. Please forgive me everyone!
(Again, just to be clear, I am NOT trying to imply that I think Sean DID have a role in this, just trying to understand what Rob meant.)
I will call it BB. You smear me because your credibility is in tatters. You used a clip on your site that could only have come from photographic material backed up and archived by Robert Wagner.
Nice try at attempting to revert to the original title of the film which is now verbotten in retail markets.
OH LORD MY LOAD IS HEAVY!
i had to get that out
actually that was Lili Tomlin from the movie "Big Business"
appropriate
OH LORD MY LOAD IS HEAVY!
roflmfao
Rob,
Yet again you are talking to someone who does not post here.
Again, it highlights your lack of credibility. That was blown out when you teamed up with Elm and claimed you were a federal agent. Tsk tsk.
V.J. - I am quite the film buff along with being a huge fan of both Tomlin and Midler, and I just looked up that title and don't believe I've ever heard of it or seen it! Good reference!
Will G--
No. Sean never discussed any such business, in any set of circumstances, before this murder with either of the murder suspects.
BB likes to claim that the Le Cirque dinner at Las Vegas is evidence of Sean and Grant's complicity in the murder. Basically, he is confusing the logical errors (in argument) of coincidence and guilt by association.
He offers no proof, only smear and other personal attacks when he isn't tossing out Yodda speak to substitute for his lack of facts.
Jim - Check out the comments on your Sword link when you have a chance. (I think I'm in trouble.)
Stuff it Wagner. You gave yourself away long ago.
The clip you used might as well be a highway marker.
Sure Kent, you can post here under three simple conditions:
1) You use your real name (Kent or Kent Barclay). Not your "stage" name or any of your imaginary followers names.
2) You do not link, mention or refer in any way to any site you operate. You use your sites primarily to engage in criminal enterprises such as cyberstalking and extortion, and I will not allow my blog to facilitate that. You have harmed too many people in the past (Gavin Braun, Angel Skye, Joey Hart, Kevin Clarke, etc. etc. etc...) and I refuse to allow that blood on my hands in any way.
3) You will not otherwise misrepresent your status, wealth, living situation, influence in the industry, city of residence, or any other biographical detail of your life in any of your comments.
So under those very reasonable conditions...post away. I'm sure we'd all be happy to hear what a guy like Kent Barclay, an unemployed internet junkie couch-surfing rent free in his mom's Boston area welfare housing, has to say about this case (or any other matters covered here).
Side note to preacher George:
First Harlow, now Kent.
You sure know how to pick 'em!
Jim - You mean he asked your PERMISSION to post? Doesn't sound like our Kentie.
Also, you required him not to lie about himself, but I would have stipulated that he not lie, PERIOD. That would have driven him crazy.
"You mean he asked your PERMISSION to post?"
Not exactly. He dared to me approve his posts...betting that I wouldn't.
Instead I saw him and raised him.
We'll see now if he calls or folds.
"Also, you required him not to lie about himself, but I would have stipulated that he not lie, PERIOD. That would have driven him crazy."
He would run out of things to say under that scenario pretty rapidly, yes.
I wonder what is going on in ree's head these days?????
I would like to be a fly on the wall around her place for a day or so, conversations between her and her hubby must be interesting.
jim,
if you do not mind my asking a question?
Do you think Ree has turned or is turning or is going to turn on
H & J-
I know it is speculating - I am curious?
See my last comment (#13) over on PC's blog latest post, vj.
That should indicate what I think Ree is up to these days.
175 returning visits...she's one of my biggest customers!
175 returning visits.
WOW!!!
You Have Got To Be Shittin me!
[jaw is droped].
I am surprised you were able to keep that to yourself.
WoW!
But Jim did you not know that the reverend gave me a way, you are my favorite blog..... Oh how i love a good dead chinchilla
JIM YOU HAVE NO BALLS , WHATS A MATTER DID YOU GET CAUGHT WITH YOU PANTS DOWN AND NOT KNOW WHAT WAS GOING ON , SHOVE YOUR HARLOWITE SHIT UP YOUR ASS! THE STATE GOT ALL THEY NEEDED!
COME ON WHOOSEY, COME AND PLAY , YOU KNOW YOU SUCK AND ARE A WEASEL NOT A CHINCHILLA!
You seem a bit out of sorts today, Ree. Just thought I'd mention that.
I AM JUST SO BROKEN HEARTED THAT YOU WERE MY #1 BLOG AND YOU WONT COME OUT AND PLAY.
#1 DEAD CHINCHILLA FAN
GLAD TO SEE THAT YOU FINALLY GREW A SET OF BALLS!
OUT OF SORTS , HELL NO JIM THIS SHIT IS WAY TO FUNNY, AND THIS IS JUST THE BEGINNING....
Ree,
Unlike what some incarcerated felons might think, I do not hover around the keyboard in my soiled jammies 24/7, approving posts within seconds after they hit the box.
Your posts went thru when I saw them. If you avoid personal attacks against your fellow bloggers, stay on topic, and do not mention the name of Kent Barclay's alter ego, your comments will be routinely processed.
Now, do you have something interesting to say?
How about we start with: Why so angry?
Jim
I dont think that we are being angry. We have been laughing at your guess work here lately. Just like Gluttony was Ree no it was actually me Jim Martin. Being a harlowite you were way off on that one. Sons of Sam was never a fake that is just the way I am. I have always been Anti-H&J since the begining. Even VJ could vouch for that. This just the way the cookie crumbles. It only gets better jim.
Well, my opinion of the SoS Blog stands. I think you in danger of generating more sympathy than non-sympathy for Harlow and Joe by maintaining it on it's current course. And if you've been following the comments here, I am not alone in that opinion.
Now, you couple that with the fact that you slipped up on several occasions, and let on that you knew things that could only have come directly from Harlow and Joe...well, you can see what led me to my erroneous "guess."
Anyhoo...I'll go ahead and ask the next obvious question...why the need for all the secrecy? If you and Ree were anti-Harlow from the get go, why maintain this charade so long? Why are you coming out now, as opposed to sooner?
Jim said
Well, my opinion of the SoS Blog stands. I think you in danger of generating more sympathy than non-sympathy for Harlow and Joe by maintaining it on it's current course. And if you've been following the comments here, I am not alone in that opinion.
Now, you couple that with the fact that you slipped up on several occasions, and let on that you knew things that could only have come directly from Harlow and Joe...well, you can see what led me to my erroneous "guess."
Anyhoo...I'll go ahead and ask the next obvious question...why the need for all the secrecy? If you and Ree were anti-Harlow from the get go, why maintain this charade so long? Why are you coming out now, as opposed to sooner?
One this is not Ree's blog its mine. As you notice PC clearly stated my witness number not hers. I dont think I create a feeling of sympathy for joe and harlow. I created a feeling of intimidation and whats on the dinner plate for them. Me I wish I could be there when they are found guilty and watching there execution.
The reason I have waited this long was to see how much I could make a mockery of people including(jim). I have never led anybody to believe I was someone else.
Till this day I have never personally talked to harlow and joe. They to me have been guilty in the begining. You just dont sit in jail for nothing make that two people dont. That is just my opinion. Also I have never had any conversations with any harlowites. Eveytime one rings my house I get constipated.
You know that I actually threw you and everybody else off gaurd.
But see you threw the accusations up first jim 3 strikes your out law pertains to me so I had to make my post on my blog to prove a point.
"The reason I have waited this long was to see how much I could make a mockery of people including(jim)."
This I do not understand.
Why would you want to make a mockery of me? You are anti-Harlow. I am anti-Harlow. We are on the same side, no?
"Also I have never had any conversations with any harlowites. Eveytime one rings my house I get constipated."
LOL!
jim said
This I do not understand.
Why would you want to make a mockery of me? You are anti-Harlow. I am anti-Harlow. We are on the same side, no?
Well when you call me a harlowite or SOS a pro harlow blog. We werent on the same team. And I belive it still stand next to my link on your page. So you tell me. You came out with all of this first. I never pointed fingers out at you calling you a harlowite.
Jim,
We are all allowed our opinons and we all have them, in our house we beleive in the death penalty but we had divided opinons on joe and harlow for a time, but when you lie and decieve and try to manipulate people then you are the liar and the murderer that you were accused of in the first place.
they lie they deceive and they would steal from your mother if given the chance, they do not need saving they need to be put to death for the crime they committed. There will never be any relief for the Kocis family until this is done. They need closure.
"Well when you call me a harlowite or SOS a pro harlow blog. We werent on the same team."
Like I said earlier, you have to take your share of the blame for that, James. You left clues that indicated you know things only a Harlow insider would know.
If you had been less careless, this mistake would not have occured.
Come to think of it, had you taken me into your confidence (as you had PC) we would have avoided this as well.
So, I tend to wonder how much of this "mockery" is projection on your part.
Well, off to edit my blogroll...
Now we are friends jim.
Just so that you know you are my wifes favorite blog.
Renee, you know, I simply cannot argue with you there.
Good, I'm glad!
Jim,
Just to show you good faith, i am I.Stole.the.2257s, do you feel better now?
We can also be friends, my chinchillas need a pal to play with they are lonely.
I feel peachy! :-)
Jim just so that you understand there is and has not been any anger towawreds you i have been having a blast this is the first time in a year that i can have this much fun. You just do not know.
As for you and your soiled jammies (that you talked about earlier)i would suggest you change them before you ass checks get chapped.
Yeah it sounds like you were eager to finally get this off your chest.
Thanks for all you've done. And I apologize for any harm done by my errors.
Renee,
I too would like to apologize.
I was wrong about you!
Looks like the Times Leader is now picking up the story...although like the CV article earlier referred to on PC's blog, there is a certain anti-Renee slant to it.
Here's what I'm talking about:
"Prosecutors requested bail for Martin because they believe she could be a flight risk, and they have been unsuccessful in the past in attempts to meet with her."
and
"Prosecutors said Martin’s testimony is needed because she has been and still is the manager for Kerekes and Cuadra’s business..."
Unsuccessful in past attempts to meet with? Still business manager? And there's no mention of the enthusiastic cooperation we saw proclaimed here last night, so...? It certainly seems the prosecution and the print media were under the impression Ree was an uncooperative witness.
If I had not seen and read what I did last night, I probably would have been under the same impression after reading the paper today.
Oh well, I'm sure we'll get more answers today.
Jim this might have something to do with Michael Melncik pulling shit when i was scheduled to go up and releasing my name on some court documents that my name was not suppose to be on, and that scheduled appt was in april, then for over four weeks i was put off, I called and complained about what was in this document and will have an attorney straighten this out if mr melnick does not. Second the part about the busines manager is something that Joe claimed to another inmate , please note there are 30 things on that submission to the court and numbers 16-20-24- 27.1 and 28.2 &3 are incorrect statements , they have been advised to fix this or i will seek counsel to represent me in this matter and that will hinder there case. Supposidly we were told that Mr. Melnick did not draw up this document , Mr. Doughtery did and that Mr. Melnick was very irritated by it. We will see how irritated he is , either it gets corrected or I seek cousel.
"Prosecutors requested bail for Martin because they believe she could be a flight risk, and they have been unsuccessful in the past in attempts to meet with her."
No unsuccessful attempts they never came to see me , they never even attempted to, if they needed to see me that bad they would of come to fort worth, they had phone contact for months. But never attempted to get on a plane and get here. Think there was some slacking on the part of the DA , lets not talk about them wanting me to pay for this trip to pa for them to talk to me, dont think i should have to pay for it, they should of paid for the ticket and i would of got on the plane just as i did when the ticket was paid for on June 1 , i drove to the airport and got on the plane, why should i pay to go there ? would you, they had all opportunites to phone me and i have the phone bills to prove it.
Jim, not to take you guys off-topic, but was wondering if you could tell me if either or both the Rolling Stone or Out articles are posted online, and if so could maybe supply a handy-dandy URL or two? Thanks!
Jim another note the part about JImmy contacting psp
(state police)is a lie, he never contacted them.....or gave them a phone interview
All VERY interesting Renee, thanks!
Will,
The link to the Out article is in my Kocisphere links to the right; the RS article does not exist online (that I know of).
Thanks so much, Jim! The Out article was the one I was most interested in anyway, so that's great.
Anytime you would like to know just ask , I dont have anything that I want to hide and I am sure most of it will be out at the hearing on July 8-9. It seems that I will be testifying at this hearing to phone calls i do not know what else at this time.
Needless to say now that i have given my formal statement to them i have no issue with putting it out, I have also told them either fix it or i will be doing my own interview with the times leader and the citizens voice on this matter and clearing the issues up myself.
I have been under the understanding that these things would be mis-represenation to the judge and subject them to perjury charges. I am only asking that they fix and correct there errors or i will be forced to hire an attorney and ask for a hearing in front of PPO to have this issue corrected and ask for them to be held over for perjury on this document filed with the court.
I do not have an issue with the truth coming out as stated in that article in the times leader : Prosecutors say martin arranged for both Cuadra and Kerekes to talk to one another via three-way conference calls and participated in converstations..... TRUE to fact.
That Cuadra and Kerekes made incriminating statements during the converstations,which Martin heard.......... TRUE to fact.
flight risk and have been unsuccessful in the past attemtpts.
NOT TRUE> they had my address, hell i let the FBI in and asked them what the hell took so long.
A texas woman who prosecutors say has been running the business of homicide suspects harlow and joe while the two are incarcerated.
NOT TRUE< this was a statement made by joe to another inmate.
Prosecutors said martins testimony is needed becuase she has and still is the manager for kerekes and cuadras business
NOT TRUE>
She can provide substantial and important information about hte defendants and their actions and she was privy to the converstions between the two defendants>
DAMN RIGHT I WAS TRUE TO FACT...
heard it all.
If you want to know anything else please just ask, I have no issue with telling all, I have given my statements to the DA
Well, you said you and your husband had "divided opinions" on H/J for a while, but then I guess you had a major epiphany on the subject (to say the least, LOL!).
I'm curious: When did this epiphany occur, and what triggered it?
Jim said:
I'm curious: When did this epiphany occur, and what triggered it?
Last year, and what triggered it was what was said on the phone calls. Does this help. I am sorry i can not tell you exactly what was said in the phone calls but look forward to it on July 8-9 hearing.
Yep, that helps makes sense of things, thanks!
Another question: Did you have any contact with Barry Taylor? If so, what is your general opinion of him?
And same question, Cheryl Conrad aka "Sassy" the P.I. General impression?
jim,
.. and you thought the summer was going to be boring!
:)
Yeah, the irony is not lost on me, v.j.!
Jim--
I believe the bail bond was imposed for two reasons. (1) Renee was an accessory after the fact. (2) Flight risk potential.
Next, I read what she was moaning about above with Melnick and his staff. Certainly, a difference in certain fact statements but with the snarky tude Renee is demonstrating and wanting her lawyer to challenge the deposed statement she made a hostile material witness in the making.
Your thoughts are appreciated as are VJ's.
rob,
When it comes to the law, I am lost.
What Renee said rang true to me.
Especially the part about them not paying for the ticket, etc.
I had some experience with this stuff during my brothers drug arrest. After he was on house arrest back In Ohio, but had to go back and forth to NYC for motion hearings and all kinds of stuff, sometimes the State paid for the tickets, sometimes they did not.
Sometimes you get there and it has been cancelled but they "forgot" to let you know, etc.
Potential was life imprisonment, so it was kind of serious.
This "state" part of the situation was very, very disorganized. A ton of work for very, very few people is how I would sum that up.
Again this is different situations but some of the particulars sound pretty familiar.
Renee,
How wonderful and refreshing you are on the blogs.
After everything I have read about you on the blogs in previous months, it really is great hearing from you in your own words.
It certainly appears that you are to be congradulated. I cant begin to imagine how this ordeal has been for you. Well done for getting through it.
By all accounts, you are the most important witness on the list to ensure justice is served, be VERY proud of that my dear.
jim said...
Another question: Did you have any contact with Barry Taylor? If so, what is your general opinion of him?
Barry Taylor bottom of the feeder bucket not worth throwing to fish as chum....... He is worthless, and decietful and pretty much a shitty lawyer. Does this help.
Rob
Do you really have shit between the ears during this whole clammity or are you required to stand infront of a microwave for a few minutes so it will energize the upper hemisphere of your brain.
bb,
Well put!
Yeah this is great, Renee, much appreciated.
Lets see, more questions I can think of...
1) Did H/J ever discuss their motive for the crime?
2) Early on there was a brou-ha-ha concerning the release of the H/J house from forfeiture, due to lack of equity...what was that all about? PC-Elm IMs seem to indicate you were rather strongly against news concerning the house coming out at the time...why?
3) Was the coat chinchilla or rabbit? :-)
4) Did you ever deal directly with Kent Barclay, and if so what was your general impression of him?
Please feel free to supplement #4 with as many colorful details and anecdotes that you deem appropriate. :-)
"Gluttony said...
Rob
Do you really have shit between the ears during this whole clammity or are you required to stand infront of a microwave for a few minutes so it will energize the upper hemisphere of your brain."
Am glad your posting too. Such wit :)
4) Did you ever deal directly with Kent Barclay, and if so what was your general impression of him?
Please feel free to supplement #4 with as many colorful details and anecdotes that you deem appropriate. :-)
Jim there will never be enough room on your blog to tell all this. But email me and i will tell you some shit that will make your head spin.
Renee,
What are your thoughts on Elm?
Jim, Hey i hear kent is wanting an exclusive interview would you please convey to him to piss off.
jim said...
Yeah this is great, Renee, much appreciated.
Lets see, more questions I can think of...
1) Did H/J ever discuss their motive for the crime?
Jim cannot answer this at this time, due to testimony that was given
So Sorry.Maybe after the July 8-9th hearing
Jim said:
3) Was the coat chinchilla or rabbit? :-)
Per conversation with Berninis about the coat they claimed that it was chincilla and the inside was full leather.
Jim Martin--
Now your wife is on the hook with the prosecution, not me. She is an informant after having been found out as an accessory first.
The spin cycle is on your end as you try to explain the contradictions.
As for shit, you jokers have been shoveling it from the beginning. Martin, you were easy to identify as witness 213.
Jim,
Contact Renee and do a proper interview. You might not get a chance at a scoop like this again :)
Well, we were in need of some fresh point of view, some new details that are not totally based in fantasy land. And we got it this week.
I do hope Renee gets a paid vacation to PA for her trouble, and that they have a nice Hyatt with pool.
And I'm sorry to hear that Harlow and/or Joe have such little in the way of reasonable doubt. I have been trying to imagine Harlow as a sweet kid who just got caught up in it all. That somehow the profile drawn up by his family directly after his arrest had a speck of truth to it. That he just could not have done this, too sweet, too nice and too everything. But deep down you just knew.
Hell... I never read the Rolling Stone piece at all. If you follow the two main blogs you get about as much of this sad sick story as you need to know.
But it ain't just the Kocis family here that is going to need closure. H/J's will never be the same either.
btw, who has the chinchilla coat now?
Rob said
As for shit, you jokers have been shoveling it from the beginning. Martin, you were easy to identify as witness 213.
Were you able to come up with this all by yourself. Humm. You scare me rob. We cannot let anything sneak past you can we.
Rob, don't you think you are being a tad ungenerous? She is now, as you say, and informant...and I think that is the all-important detail to keep in mind currently.
So lets keep the focus on this wonderful, positive new development...thanks!
BB--
Just for you. I noted Elm's involvement in the 3-way jailhouse communication's scheme last summer. You claimed with Elm that didn't happen. Well, looks like it did. And, Elm isn't happy about it.
Read the court papers regarding the bail bond hearing for Renee. I said last night she was a material witness. Were that I was always that way off.
As for you, you didn't get much of a pass. All Renee said last night of you was she didn't know of you or your whereabouts. What a non endorsement if ever there was one.
1) Did H/J ever discuss their motive for the crime?
--------------
Oh, please you gotta be kidding.
I think it was not just about making a movie and the potential profits. He (Harlow) wanted to have sex with Brent, and have Brent think of him as a super hero who saved him and his career from ruin. Sexual obsession is what they call it.
Jim--
I will take your remark as presented subject to reexamination later because you are entitled to a stellar moment.
Oh yay, over 100 comments!
"BB said...
Jim,
Contact Renee and do a proper interview. You might not get a chance at a scoop like this again :)"
Oh I don't give a hooey about getting any "scoop."
Fixation on "scoops" is for pathologically insecure bloggers living in welfare motels with their mothers, in order to make it look like they are players in the industry (when in fact, they are not).
So, lets keep it here...other can ask questions this way too.
BB please do us all a favor and put rob in his place ..
Thank you very much.
5. Actually lets back up in time, to before the murder. When did you first meet your neighbors, Harlow and Joe? Did you interact with them much before the crime? What was it like having them as neighbors?
I did not interact with them much nobody in the whole neighborhood did from what I recall. I saw them walking around the coldesac with there dog. Both of them always wore daisy duke shorts. But other than that they did not speak or wave to you.
jim said...
5. Actually lets back up in time, to before the murder. When did you first meet your neighbors, Harlow and Joe? Did you interact with them much before the crime? What was it like having them as neighbors?
Well after we moved in and they had been living there for a while probably sometime about march 06. Did not interact with them said hi in a neighborly fashion talked to them about typical home owner stuff, and shit about having trees removed from my yard and theres. As for having them as neighbors , well you would not have known they lived there, you hardly ever saw them , and the cars coming and going from there house was not real noticeable , looked like every day traffic, nothing unusual. Until the damn raid that woke up the whole neighborhood. Now that shit was funny and what was even funnier was Jimmy watching so intently. They were there until after four pm that day and hauled bags and bags of shit out of the house.( Dont ask what was in the bags cause I have no idea.)
jim said...
Oh yay, over 100 comments!
"BB said...
Jim,
Contact Renee and do a proper interview. You might not get a chance at a scoop like this again :)"
Oh I don't give a hooey about getting any "scoop."
Fixation on "scoops" is for pathologically insecure bloggers living in welfare motels with their mothers, in order to make it look like they are players in the industry (when in fact, they are not).
So, lets keep it here...other can ask questions this way too.
Congrats on the 100 comment mark, now as for the motel trash why are you comparing you to him? There is no comparison , he is motel trash.
Follow up to 5) There was a story circulating about that H/J were in the neighborhood at the time of the raid too, observing it covertly from a distance. Is that true, do you know?
If you barely know them, Ree, what made you such a devote supporter of H&J after the arrest? I recall your blog entries over at Harlow's and always thought you are someone very very close to them.
Yeah, good question Bryn, that was gonna be my 6). :-)
In other words...how on earth did you get caught up in this mess in the first place???
Yes that is a good question to ask.
jim said...
Yeah, good question Bryn, that was gonna be my 6). :-)
In other words...how on earth did you get caught up in this mess in the first place???
Jim,
Sorry again I cannot answer that one either at this time, but this should come out at the hearing on July 8-9 , this hearing should be very interesting to say the least.
7) To your knowledge, did anyone else ever arrange a 3-way prison phone call with H and J?
jim said...
7) To your knowledge, did anyone else ever arrange a 3-way prison phone call with H and J?
Jim again i cannot answer this question until the hearing. Sorry.
OK, lets go back to an "early day" question.
7) Was it common knowledge in the neighborhood the H/J house was being used for prostitution? What was the level of concern over this?
And I guess that should be 8) not 7)...
jim said...
OK, lets go back to an "early day" question.
7) Was it common knowledge in the neighborhood the H/J house was being used for prostitution? What was the level of concern over this?
I believe most of the neighborhood knew about what they did. But i am not sure. Dont due it in the street and in front of my kids and I dont care what you do at your house, just dont bring it to mine.
Renee,
Rob is not worth the time of day. I banter back and forth with him coz it amuses me.
He knows nothing. Never has. Never will.
How he must dislike you with all your knowledge :)
In another blog Renee responds "[Harlow and Joe] started screaming we are innocent,[;]I got involved with this through a third party that believed [the two men] and convinced me that they were innocent."
Are you referring to Elm?
BB said...
Renee,
Rob is not worth the time of day. I banter back and forth with him coz it amuses me.
He knows nothing. Never has. Never will.
How he must dislike you with all your knowledge :)
June 6, 2008 12:36 AM
Well if he will provide his phone number i will forward it on to joe and harlow and ask them to call him and tell him what he wants to know. the best i can do for him.
I love the fact that you get his goose all the time. Keep up the good work.
Jim--
I have put with the pointless dribble from BB. Exactly how is his claptrap contributing to the discussion here?
I have raised a series of questions and brought out facts some of which BB has claimed never were and low and behold those facts exist and those events did happen.
Aside from smear, what is his point?
Maybe in the near future I should have a nice harlowite outing post.
Rob, I think it's best that everyone declare a cease fire on their interpersonal blogger conflicts for now.
9) What is your opinion on the relative guilt of Harlow and Joe? Do you think one can validly claim to be less guilty due "spousal abuse" or some such?
Renee, have you ever heard from Harlow's Mom? I wonder how she is holding up?
I always took it you were the neighbor who was willing to help sell the assets that remained for a small commission (yard sale, house sale), and had not yet seem that much damaging evidence, and so figured it was a case of innocent until proven guilty. Or innocent until it jumps up and bites you in the ass.
At some point, you were bitten real hard apparently.
Harlow's only chance as a small "ice cube in fiery hell" is to claim that as a kid he being sexually abused, he turned to drugs and prostitution, which made him seek revenge on BK after reading about the Cobra guy.
Years of torment!!!
Lots of tears on the stand and acting worthy of an Oscar.
wow, its been such a long time trying to keep pace with new posts :)
Say Jim--
I raised points from the Prosecution's bail bond papers.
Next, I do believe that like Dewayne who has just posted on PC's calling Renee on certain of her statements and received a response, and you, last night, were attacked while asking relevant questions. Not so different.
My point is we are trying to stay on subject. What's the deal with BB? I detect no relevant Renee, Joe or Harlow, or Jim Martin question, knowledge question that pertains to what Renee would or would not know.
Rob,
I've begun weed-wacking comments via moderation from both you and bb that (IMO) pertain more to your ongoing feud than to the subject matter at hand.
You know that generally I'm pretty tolerant when it comes to posting, but today is special and I think some clarity here is demanded.
Thanks for your understanding.
jim said...
9) What is your opinion on the relative guilt of Harlow and Joe? Do you think one can validly claim to be less guilty due "spousal abuse" or some such?
cannot respond at this time. I am sure this will also be disclosed at the hearing on july 8-9
Sorry
Renee, have you ever heard from Harlow's Mom? I wonder how she is holding up?
Renee, have you ever heard from Harlow's Mom? I wonder how she is holding up?
I always took it you were the neighbor who was willing to help sell the assets that remained for a small commission (yard sale, house sale), and had not yet seem that much damaging evidence, and so figured it was a case of innocent until proven guilty. Or innocent until it jumps up and bites you in the ass.
At some point, you were bitten real hard apparently. and had not yet seem that much damaging evidence, and so figured it was a case of innocent until proven guilty. Or innocent until it jumps up and bites you in the ass.
At some point, you were bitten real hard apparently.
As for Harlows mom dont know talk to her some in the beginning but not in many months.
It was innocent until proven quilty until i was bit and strangled by that snake.
Renee, have you ever heard from Harlow's Mom? I wonder how she is holding up?
I always took it you were the neighbor who was willing to help sell the assets that remained for a small commission (yard sale, house sale),
You are apparently talking about Joe's mom she is the one that set up the auction to sell off the house goods and such. As for the house all i did was refer a real estate agent and she got the listing to sell it.
Rob said: My point is we are trying to stay on subject. What's the deal with BB? I detect no relevant Renee, Joe or Harlow, or Jim Martin question, knowledge question that pertains to what Renee would or would not know.
Rob will you get over yourself, no one really wants to hear and crap from your mouth anymore. You have been rambling and rambling for almost the last year and about nothing. Give it up will ya.
Hey Jim dont shut them down on my account . I have to go and do homework anyway. Have some stuff due for school.
Let them fight it out and I will have some good reading later when the homework is done, ok
Thanks
OK, Renee, sounds good.
DeWayne, responding to Renee wrote,
Quoting Renee: "Hell I ordered off the wrong menu and got several supeonas from the DA's office."
Dewayne replied, "Well a pretty flippant way to describe collusion with murderers. Any reasonable person would have known from Feb 3-5th 2007(Harlows photo surfaces) and certainly after the Felony Swat raid of Feb 10th, that Joe and Harlow were (strongly)suspected of murdering Bryan Kocis.
Joe reached out to me too (April 28)do you think I entertained the idea for a nanosecond of involvement with them?
I am sure we do all appreciate the testimony against Joe and Harlow you will make at trial, but respectfully Renee J & H's lawyers will have a field day with if you have attitude on the stand.
I would be highly embarrassed at my involvement with J & H and would project an attitude of making amends, not cracking jokes.
At the end of the day this is a deadly serious case with two men facing the death penalty for a brutal, vicious murder and we should all be committed to seeing them convicted."
Dewayne has detected the same issue regarding the material witness that I noticed earlier today as well and so stated. Interesting that Renee mentioned she was served with several subpoenas from the DA in Luzerne County. I don't prosecutors necessarily do that with cooperative, collaborating informants.
Lets ALL look at the bigger picture here. Renee did her duty. For that she is to be congradulated - not attacked.
Renee,
Please excuse me if this has already been asked.
Why do you think Harlow and Joe have not taken a deal??
"BB said...
Lets ALL look at the bigger picture here. Renee did her duty. For that she is to be congradulated - not attacked."
Yep I agree.
VJ, I strongly suspect a deal is in the works. Joe turning on Harlow would be my best guess right now.
The Renee revelations make it more likely one will sing if they have not already.
Guys, just got through reading the thread up to now. Read the OUT article today, so am somewhat up to speed, but a lot of this leaves someone like me in the dust, though much of it is fascinating to say the least.
I'll repeat a question I asked in DK thread: Is it at all possible for her to answer questions pertaining to HIM over there at another time perhaps? (NOT trying to take it away from your blog, Jim, just thought it might be the more appropriate venue. . .)
"I don't [think] prosecutors necessarily do that with cooperative, collaborating informants."
According to PC, these bonds and subpoenas will be SOP with all out-of-state witnesses to this case.
Renee,
Were any of the 3-way conversations recorded?
bb,
I agree with you!
on another note -
guys,
this "Renee Revelation"
has got to be devastating to defense, absolutely devastating.
Again bb I agree but do wonder what Renee thinks.
Cannot help but wonder what elm, jakester etc are thinking about now either?
Not gloating here- things look gloomier than ever in a situation where I thought there was no room for more.
I think that's an excellent suggestion, Will.
Ree can apparantly "spill a Caspian Sea of ink" on her dealings with Kent, and I'll bet she's eager to do so.
In fact, I'm also interested in getting specifics of her dealings with other individuals she may have had contact with behind the scenes, in particular:
1) Barry Taylor
2) Cheryl Conrad
3) Elm
4) George "Preacher" Thompson
5) Jakester
6) Jason Ridge
7) Jason Sechrest
8) Jeffrey Keith
9) Joe "Captain Jack" Ryan
10) Mitch Halford
11) Nep
I think it would be fascinating to find out a bit more about the position of all the playing pieces on the chessboard. And probably won't cause a problem with her testimony at the upcoming hearing (?).
But yeah, Kent stories would most likely have the highest entertainment value. :-)
darn, I check out a thread then think, ok I'll check out one last thread then do some work HA. Fat chance of that happening. May as well call it a 'day off' at this point :)
BB said...
Renee,
Were any of the 3-way conversations recorded?
BB i am sorry i can not answer this at this time.
Yeah bb, this has been a rather unproductive day for me too!
But yeah, Kent stories would most likely have the highest entertainment value. :-)
Yes, it will be very entertaining if you will do my homework i will entertain you with Kent stories..
You will love this, please all note i will be between homework, jims house, and pcs house, i will not be entertaining and imaginary dk interviews this evening.
He will be smoking off his big crack pipe at that 5.00 a night motel.
Hey do we all get to have a party at the trial?
I bet Kentie is quaking in his boots ALMOST as bad as J & H at the prospect of her telling what she knows!
Renee said,
"Hey do we all get to have a party after the trial"
Funny you should ask that,
I have given great thought to my interest in meeting the people I have been spending and enjoying so much time with this past year.
If I do decide to go, it will not be for the trial, I would like to meet you guys in a social environment and will rent out a restaurant for dinner for us all or something like that. I would enjoy that very much, spending some time with you guys- very much!! including Renee and James, of course.
"Hey do we all get to have a party at the trial?"
Right after verdict is read would be a good time :)
I'll be there.
I can open my blog comments section to talk about KB there... let me know what you all think of that idea.
Awesome lets plan the party , Genettis has a nice banquett hall acutally several of them. I think everyone would fit for sure.
Dk buys the first truck load of drinks to make all his lies right over the last year. No food stamps will be excepted at this party!
"Funny you should ask that,
I have given great thought to my interest in meeting the people I have been spending and enjoying so much time with this past year.
If I do decide to go, it will not be for the trial, I would like to meet you guys in a social environment and will rent out a restaurant for dinner for us all or something like that. I would enjoy that very much, spending some time with you guys- very much!! including Renee and James, of course."
There are few i'd like to come face to face with. They'd prolly not show up anyways.
BB said...
I can open my blog comments section to talk about KB there... let me know what you all think of that idea.
OMG you are actally going to open your blog for post!!
Lets see if that happens
PC sorry to poop on the parade but i felt better opening the dk story here. I feel that it would be in the best interest of all humans to know what a shit bag dk and all his lies are.
BB I am sorry i already took the dk thing to PCs blog if he doesnt throw me out.... lets see what he does if not we head your way.
Jim, help please. Which blog is this they are referring to?
Well, I personally see no reason why the "Kent Story" can't be crossposted to multiple blogs (that will welcome it). Post here. Cut. Paste. Post elsewhere. Repeat!
In fact that would be ideal, IMO.
I'm not sure, Will, I'm losing track myself, but...as I suggested just now, let's post it everywhere!
Yes, I agree, but it sounded like this was about to happen NOW on another blog, did I misinterpret that?
After many months of closed comments, BB has kindly opened his blog for comments.
BB did his very first KB/DK post.
Many said I supported DK. Those people fail to provide any backup of that claim. I never blogged about the nutter for a reason. Everyone else was doing it. Simple eh.
Enjoy.
Hey i posted it on pcs and he did not po po the party yet so lets get it going , i will tell it all
Renee and James,
Do You know who Preacher George is? I mean have you heard of him before the blog situation, like around your prior Harlow/Joe situation?
Jim - If YOU'RE losing track, I don't feel so bad! I just want to particpate in any DK discussion that goes on, wherever it happens.
PC's blog seems where the action is beginning...
V.J. said...
Renee and James,
Do You know who Preacher George is? I mean have you heard of him before the blog situation, like around your prior Harlow/Joe situation?
No he is very new to the scene as ou can tell.
jim said...
PC's blog seems where the action is beginning...
Jim you have done very well for yourself in the last couple of day.
Thanks, as have you!
Sorry everyone, I'm new around here.
Which is PC's blog?
You know, if you two still have Kent's original emails (or voicemails) from the period, that might be fun to post too. Just a suggestion!
http://handjtrial.blogspot.com/
OK gang, I have to get back to the real world now for a spell (not to mention dropping off my soiled jammies at the dry cleaners)...and since I'm approaching 200 comments anyways, I'll shut this thread down.
I'll be back with a new topic to post under for us all (Renee's Revelations, Part II). In the meantime, the party moves to PC and BB's and SoS and anywhere else it might end up at. Ta for now! :-)
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